I enjoyed this podcast initially due to the good journalism and content. The topic needed light shed upon it, and truth to be uncovered. However, when AA is framed as set up for cis white men, you lost me. The term of being powerless over your addiction, while confusing, doesn’t mean what you explained. There are many great AA groups, so please don’t bash it or make it about race or other mental disorders. People should be empowered to recover, not be labeled as victims. If it’s not for you, find something else.

This is a very good podcast and it exposes a predator. Where you lost me is when you start interviewing people regarding women in AA. Much of what was said is just false and if you actually go into the archives you would have seen that. There are predators in 12 step programs, men and women. The people in those programs are well aware. We do our best to weed them out but AA is not the reason nor the problem. If these people you interviewed do not understand what the powerlessness is about I would be happy to explain it to them. It is not what they have said on your podcast and their explanation of it has actually led to many addicts becoming perpetual victims which can destroy them. I really hope if you are going to do anymore on this you get the truth. I have been clean for 31 years and have seen a lot.

Thank you for doing this podcast. I only wish I’d found it sooner- I won’t say who, but someone I know was suckered by Eric’s excellent smooth talk and lies into accepting a job. Only to find out his true history, that they would never actually get a bonus structure, and now so so much more. His current COO: yea, it’s the lady who wrote you a letter after you published your article…his former assistant. He somehow doesn’t understand why he can’t retain employees- it’s because he is a sociopathic pervert who has replaced substances with money as his addiction. He will step on and abuse anyone to get it. I can only assume he is bribing people to get approval for some of these facilities. A hotel can’t magically become a sober living facility. It doesn’t work that way. Don’t believe a word out of his mouth and run the other direction.

February 2025 I began this podcast. I am a women in recovery who has been struggling to support AA. My personal experience within the halls of AA encountered sexual harassment and I’ve witnessed it done to others. This podcast has expressed my frustration and anger towards those who witness or engage in this behavior. I’ve pulled away since Covid and I’ve remained sober. My voice and actions against such behavior is always ignored or dismissed. Thank you for this investigation. Treatment centers are riddled with abuse and and bad actors

People in power taking advantage of people they think they can abuse need to be held to account and justice is needed. Money and threats cannot be used to escape and start a new scam in another location. This crosses the line between white collar crime and violent crime and should be prosecuted for punishment and retrieval of funds. The only thing better would be conviction.

This series is riveting. So well reported, well told, entertaining and so important. Everything investigative reporting is supposed to be. And an indictment of the manosphere that is becoming so pervasive in American culture. It deserves a Pulitzer, Peabody and multiple federal investigations into the types of creeps that are exposed by this series.

Great production and skillfully reported. A story everyone needs to know about. Such bravery to investigate. Congratulations on a job well done.

Amazing and brutal story. A gripping story and stellar display of true journalism. Bravo 👏🏼

Story telling and the music and sound effects / cuts where all excellent. The topic is just being scratched. Personally I would have liked it a little better if it wasn’t so much about the reporter (although that was interesting) but there is so much more about the topic of vulnerability being taken advantage. Or how a lot of people do criticize people for not recovering in a certain way. There was a review talking about how to blame the AA program on “white men” seems wrong and I would agree. I don’t know if the podcast really explicitly says that but there is a good focal on it. I think what would be more beneficial (because some of it does have to do with male dominate trauma and female trauma) there should be a discussion about these experiences. Or a discussion more about different therapy types (like EMDR, IFS etc) can be applied with the 12 step to make up for the short comings of the steps. Because healing trauma and recovering from a substance is different and both need to be attacked at the same time (same time meaning in the healing process —you should do a lot of these therapies when someone is sober and in a safe spot). With that all being said—it’s worth the listen , even if you aren’t passionate about recovery. The show is captivating.

I’m a pod junkie and this is a top tier listen to me. Checks all the boxes. Nice job everyone!

Lauren is a really, really gifted storyteller. This is a great podcast you will binge quickly. It goes in some wide ranging directions but all of them are compelling.

So good all around. Binged it in a half day. Subject matter so so gross not sure how these people can sleep

Why wouldn’t you block the guy on social media accounts & block their phone number? I don’t understand

I was enjoying your POD cast until you decided you give an uniformed report on AA. I have been sober for 17 years. I was first sent to AA when I was 22 years old. It took me a long time to finally get it. The first step is about powerless . I fought for years. To admit I was an Alcoholic. I was help by both men and lots of woman in AA. It did save my life . Is it perfect? Absolutely not. But your reporting on AA was biased. You forgot to mention AA is free. Yes the book was written in 1939. And yes it was written by mostly white men. Many groups have changed the language of chapter five “How it works “ There are meeting for LGBTQ, woman and men’s meetings. The AA book.. it is not Dogma. One of the AA traditions is to practice “principles before personalities” Some meetings become dominated by a “personality.” I’ve seen this as exceptions and the meetings usually don’t last. It contains wonderful spiritual wisdom. The 12th step says . . having HAD a “spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to practice these principles in all our affairs.” You and your guests failed to mention the 12 traditions.. these are the guidelines of how AA groups are supposed to function. For the most part they do. Oh did I mention it’s free. I have been to meetings all over the world. I am keen to speak up when a group is breaking traditions. No one with any real recovery and and emotional sobriety will say that AA is all you need. Also the 4th step is about a fearless inventory . It is about taking responsibility . It is about being responsible for our reactions. Many meetings here in SF Bay Area also have announcers in the beginning about AA being a safe space. And AA is fully self supporting declining outside contributions. That is our 7th tradition. AA is not for everyone. I will concede that.. but it is not some hotbed of misogyny and sexism. It is also not the vanguard for mental health. Oh did I mention it’s free? I think you should do more research . I am speaking as a member about my experience. Thanks. John T Oakland CA

The story of exploring people in recovery is not new. The methods of recovery are all like that

I spent nearly twenty years in AA. And I left. I didn’t die and I didn’t go to jail. If you like AA, then stay. But if you feel awful, it’s not you. Walk away. Many, many people have left and have never felt better. What we works for you. But you’re not broken. I have never felt better. Leaving AA was the best thing I’ve ever done. It gave me self esteem. The predators in AA exploit the message in AA. This happens a lot. Many people don’t want to discuss it because the believe it will scare away the newcomers. My advice is to just walk away.

Incredible reporting. Lauren is empathetic, thorough, and likeable. Despite the immense odds stacked against her and this story, she perseveres with grace. Very inspired by this podcast.

This podcast truly is next-level journalism, one that shines light on an important issue in a long-misunderstood and underrepresented arena: addiction and recovery. Not only does “The 13th Step” tell a riveting - and yeah, totally unsettling and disturbing at times - situation regarding sexual misconduct/abuse and the quest to uncover the truth, but it also explores the broader epidemic of addiction in the U.S. in the recent past, how general perceptions have evolved, and how regulations/training standards and practices in the field have been slow to catch on. Not to mention just how insane some of the twists and turns in the story are (wow). For anyone who is struggling with addiction, has struggled, or knows someone with substance use disorder, this is essential listening.

Terrible to hear about vandalism and threats against the reporter. Nobody deserves that! My father did the 12 step program in 1990 and it saved his life and my parent’s marriage. Obviously no program is perfect but to blame white males for all of the problems is a joke. My father went through rehab with patients of all ages, genders, sexual orientation and they leaned on each other. Bad apples are in all walks of life sadly.

So glad there is finally a voice for so many voiceless. Thank you again Lauren, for your bravery, tenacity and willingness. If you are sober or love someone who is sober and in recovery please listen.

Finally, this story is being told. Very grateful for this podcast.

One of the best I’ve listened to all year.

Thank you

Bravo. Excellent job. Highly recommend!!

Profoundly deep and thought provoking!

Amazing podcast! 10 stars!!!

Another really well done podcast by an NHPR journalist. Binge worthy, thought provoking, & well done.

It’s an infuriating binge-worthy story. Right wing media are attempting to discredit the story, saying Spofford wanted to share his side and was denied. Somehow I doubt that—I’ll keep listening to find out.

This is precisely why the first amendment exists. This story, unflinchingly, speaks truth to power. A must listen, especially for those who work a solid program. 13th stepping is not what true self healing is about.

I’m not sure what scares me more in this podcast. That these purveyors of so-called treatment centers can run with such minimal oversight and/ or licensing or that the states chose to amply fund them regardless. The outcomes should surprise no one. It took a few brave women to pursue this story, at length, and at considerable risk to their being or careers. They are heroines, indeed. An important lesson, even if only to remind us that it’s ok to question everything.

Superbly crafted and meticulously researched. Another story about hubris, abuse, and manipulation—all too common in our culture of relentless pursuit of fame, money, and power.

I’m only on Episode 3 but am greatly moved by the truth of the 13th Step podcast. I experienced lesser degrees of the 13th step in an AA “recovery program”. I was immediately out of jail for a 2nd DUI in first time recovery.I was older (39), so I think I spotted predators through previous experiences more quickly than some of the younger women in my program. I mentioned what I experienced (FB friend requests unsolicited and reactions to my physique when I came to meetings after a morning bike ride) to “old timers”. They told me, “oh yeah, he’s a 13th stepper”. Then explained the term. I was smart/old enough to get myself out of those situations (“no thank you” I don’t need a ride or want to go to the beach , etc.) but I later spoke with younger women who had clearly been abused. I spoke out and got a particular predator banned from our group. It is a very sad reality of the “anonymous” nature of 12step. You come in broken, you think you found a new “family” who you can trust in the most vulnerable time of your life.

Amazingly informative and well done.

Do yourself a favor and listen this unflinching look at a grotesque abuse of power in a largely unregulated industry.

Enjoyed every minute of it!

Thank you for bringing this issue to light. Incredible that people take advantage of others who are at their lowest point. Keep advocating!

Responsible and important to hear. Advocacy for people with substance use disorder is vital, Lauren does this.

Very dangerous to paint this as an epidemic and a reason to avoid AA and twelve step. Any reasonable investigation within the program would uncover that 13 stepping is frowned upon and actively discouraged within the rooms. Linking one individual’s alleged conduct to 12 step and AA in general may prevent some to get help as a reason to avoid checking out a life line that saves lives.

This was an enlightening listen. As a mental health provider I have long known the troubles in recovery treatment. This podcast highlights particularly criminal elements of it and areas of danger, especially for women seeking treatment. I am amazed, inspired and so grateful to Lauren for continuing to cover this despite the risks to her own safety and even safety of her parents. She is exceptionally brave as are the women who shared their stories.

If you or a loved one have any interest in the quality of addiction treatment, this is priceless. Not all 12 step groups or recovery centers have these problems-most can be life savers & safe places. But unethical & untrained “counselors” or CEO’s do exist. Lots depends on state legislation and professional licensing boards.

Couldn’t stop listening

Wow. I couldn’t stop listening to this story. Thank you for bringing light to the situation.

I lost too many friends due to addiction in the combination of ways someone can fall into this lifestyle. I was one of them and luckily I had my family that didn’t give up on me but too many are not as fortunate. And now to discovered that someone had a chance to do this important work for recovery and and take it to a greater level, and instead, turned it into a system that took advantage of these vulnerable people is beyond my tolerance. Thank you for exposing this. I will share this report and do what I can to help.

In episode 3 the use of legal processes to defend accused (but not yet found guilty) defendants was overly sensationalized which undermined a generally interesting podcast about a clearly problematic industry. Litigation holds are standard process for people accused of wrongdoing, especially in preparation of first amendment lawsuits.

I have been sober 17 years and early on I felt so out of place in AA. Everything that was said in this podcast validates that feeling and why I quietly went my own way to figure out how to stay sober. Thank you for this. Excellent podcast.

Lauren takes her time, tells the story with clarity, and protects the victims in a responsible way while allowing their experiences to be heard. It’s a terrible topic, and I honestly had no idea that this type of predatory behavior existed in the recovery community. We all need to know more about this.

This podcast really incisive reporting delivered in a way that pulled me in and told a story. I value the things that I learned and how it has helped inform my perspective and views.

Quality journalism here. Anxiously awaiting updates… Really hoping this guy has to pay for his crimes.

Highly recommend

The info in this podcast isn’t news to anyone in the treatment or behavioral health fields, but it’s probably shocking to those who are not. Treatment is a racket. This podcast is only a drop in the bucket. Please listen & share widely, it’s important!